Intelligence linked with evil?

[_Quietus_]

Okay, why don't we stop debating on what is good and what is evil.

Let's just say that evil is benefiting from others at their expense, in a manipulative, or devious manner.

Like corperations

[kholhaus]

Quietus,

arguing what is good and what is evil is what makes it subjective.

Which is to say, the point of establishing what good and evil are, thus making it possible to define them.

Manipulating others at their expense doesn't necessarily mean 'evil', however.

Without Corporations, there would not be an organized outlet for the products that we use daily. I won't use the words 'necessary evil', because a lot of corporations just make executive decisions that do not appeal to some. But they appeal to their users that they hold in higher interest.

Corporation and Corruption are often linked, this is true.

But have you ever noticed, that 'Cor' and 'tion' are in both? I think for opponents of big business, this coincidence plays right into their hands. Also, for those that already have negative opinions on corporations, confirmation bias plays a factor in their viewpoint. They only see the 'EVIL' in their actions, and very little of the 'GOOD'.

I don't have a strong opinion that I want you to sway to, just to think 'Are ALL corporations really "Evil"'?

[IDSeeker]

-cut-

"Good" and "evil" at the start, sound like a search for what is socially acceptable. But the problem with this is that seeing them as such discredits the things that have been coming up even from within our own societies. If they were simply a means to preserve some kind of status quo by trying to fit in a society, then why is it that there have been cases of people fighting for their rights? Wouldn't it be that people should be assimilated into the dominant culture then? Wouldn't it be that if that was the case, people who are within a dominant identity shouldn't associate with others who are within the minority, yet they still do because they are doing what they feel is right? Shouldn't it be that he should just ignore "the Others" who aren't him because society tells him that they're not worth thinking about?

-cut-

But I never said that people are forced to follow social acceptance: it merely tells you what is the course of actions that will lead to general consensus ("good"), but everyone in the end have the free will to choose whatever they think is right (following their personal moral compass), full aware that their actions will lead to an appropriate social response and consequential label. And if you think about it, millennia have passed before someone though that all men are equal and started to fight for this ideal; in the meantime (roman empire, dark ages) everyone followed the unjust ("evil" by our standards, but "good" by theirs) law of the emperor/king. Once, "goodness" was equal to "burn the witch"; "justice" was equal to "an eye for an eye"; "freedom" was equal to "win the war, enslave the enemy survivors/minority" and "love" was equal to "let's make a progeny to help us work in the crop fields of the king/to let our royal blood live through the centuries". And all was "good".

[A.I.]

I think the implication that intelligence is proportional to evil is nothing short of silly. A tendency to do wrong, be it based in wrath, greed, or what-have-you, is completely detached from the magnitude of one's mental abilities. Moreover, the argument otherwise is completely unfounded.

Sentience and further intelligence only contribute to evil insofar as they allow beings to pursue what they wish to pursue. A creature's inclination toward right or wrong is not born from its intelligence, but rather amplified.

We're also greatly downplaying the complexity of the notions at play here. As has already been said, right and wrong are subjective, but that's just square one. The factors which lead to any of our actions are completely innumerable. The psychology at hand is similarly complicated. If a person is "evil," it's because the events and thoughts which produced him have inclined him to do what we consider to be bad; his intelligence only lets him act accordingly, and the same would be true for a person we consider to be good.

[ArmsAreLoud]

Intelligence doesn't cause evil.

Intelligence makes you want to define it.

[Wessolf27]

But I never said that people are forced to follow social acceptance: it merely tells you what is the course of actions that will lead to general consensus ("good"), but everyone in the end have the free will to choose whatever they think is right (following their personal moral compass), full aware that their actions will lead to an appropriate social response and consequential label. And if you think about it, millennia have passed before someone though that all men are equal and started to fight for this ideal; in the meantime (roman empire, dark ages) everyone followed the unjust ("evil" by our standards, but "good" by theirs) law of the emperor/king. Once, "goodness" was equal to "burn the witch"; "justice" was equal to "an eye for an eye"; "freedom" was equal to "win the war, enslave the enemy survivors/minority" and "love" was equal to "let's make a progeny to help us work in the crop fields of the king/to let our royal blood live through the centuries". And all was "good".

But behind all that, behind all the social dogma and hegemonic structures that have been with us from time immemorial, don't you think there's still a reason for why people wanted some quality of "good" and that everyone has at least a number of morals that are shared by all? Sure, at first it might have been limited only to those that they had cared for, but there was still that sense that you would want some kind of peace and trust between comrades and friends, that you'd expect love from a mother or father, that you'd expect that there was some respect towards people who we look up to or those equal to us. A lot of these had been rather self-centered wants at the beginning, but because there was this capacity to communicate and bond, there came an unwritten code that says that there is some kind of "good" that we all believe and share in, that at first, it might just apply to you, the people close to you, your race. your people... but eventually it applied to the whole of humanity because even with the vast differences in cultures, we realized that there was some common idea of "good" that binds us together. Isn't that commonality between many of us what then comes to become what is the admittedly vague idea of an "objective good"?

[_Quietus_]

It doesn't seem like people are even talking about whether intelligence causes evil.
I think they're just talking about the subjective nature of good and evil.

[A.I.]

That's kind of an important subtopic. Plus, both issues are being discussed in fairly equal measures.

[Bohandas]

That's just how dolphin groups function, really. It's not as much "evil" for them as the fact that they're a highly polygamous species(like most mammals) that lives in pods where individuals demonstrate dominance. If you're classifying evil as some kind of savagery, then I'd say no, intelligence doesn't breed more acts like that. What is a seemingly random act of evil may actually have evolutionary benefits for an individual, particularly rape. Obviously for intelligent creatures like humans, this is one of the most savage acts we can think of. I think our intelligence and societal structure cuts down on this kind of "evil," but we have found ways to subjugate others in our own way. In my mind, the real difference is that we actually define evil.

I agree, that's just how Dolphin groups function. Plenty of less intelligent animals behave the same way.

That said, intelligence of the sort exhibited by humans is linked with evil because the combination of tool-use, planning, and communication enables unnaturally widespread and brutal excesses. It makes the difference between killing an individual who bothers you and slaughtering 57 people a rifle and grenades. It makes the difference between a small conflict between two groups of apes and war that devastates Europe.

That said, for the most part, good and evil are merely illusions constructed by society and the human mind.

[scrafty]

Hmm, this is a really interesting idea.

If anything, I think intelligence is what enables us to understand "evil" at all--it is something we learn. We may have some sense of morals when we are born, but let's be honest, society pretty much dictates a majority of what's wrong and right: killing, rape, stealing, etc. As we grow up, we learn from our environments around us and are able to form our own opinions and think rhetorically. With these new-found thinking skills, we can test our once-concrete rules; like, killing is bad. If somebody kills another person for self-defense, is it evil? It's still killing, but is it okay in this instance because of x y and z?

If we think about it, most people who we would call "evil" see nothing wrong with what they're doing. It may be obvious to us, but for them, they took on a different sense of morality than ours. To them, it isn't evil--it is their version of "good", or they feel "misunderstood". This may not be the case with every person, however, but look at it this way: a man kills his wife because she was cheating on him. Evil to us, right? But in his mind, he thinks he is doing the right thing. She cheated on him, so she deserves to be punished. He is doing a good thing by punishing her because she deserved it. Even if he comes to regret it afterwards, when he took part it in, he wasn't thinking, "hm, I'm going to kill you because I feel like it." He was thinking "you did something to hurt me, so now I'm going to punish you and get justice."

Okay, that makes sense, you might be thinking, but what about people like serial killers? Evil, right?

Well, in all honesty, I don't think so. I think they are people that may be bad, yes, but that's only by my standards and the majority of society's standards. Serial killers tend to target only certain people. The people they target are usually people who are similar to people who have abused them in the past. For example, if their mother was heavy-set and blonde and their mother used to abuse them, a serial killer may go off to murder only people who are heavy-set and blonde. In their heads, they are seeking justice and perhaps preventing other people from being abused. Obviously it's not true, but they are so convinced that it is that they're able to commit these horrendous crimes.

There are also cases where you can factor in things like alcohol, drug usage and even mental illnesses that can be linked to "evil" activities. There is always a trigger of some kind, which is why I think there is no such thing as a truly "evil" person.

If there was ever a person who committed a heinous act just for the hell of it, then yes, that is most likely evil. But I don't exactly link that to intelligence.

TL;DR,
No. I think intelligence is just what makes us able to define evil. Not what causes it.

[OrangeAipom]

In the wild male Dolphins are known to gang rape other dolphins, and humans sometimes, doesn't matter if the victim is male or female.

At least dolphins aren't sexist.

Corporation and Corruption are often linked, this is true.

But have you ever noticed, that 'Cor' and 'tion' are in both?

[kholhaus]

Goddamn do I love me some Jon Stewart.

I was aware I was being absurdist, even to Glenn Beckian extremes.
I just didn't know Jon did that.
That is a wonderful thing.

[CSJ]

Ha.

They thought they could get rid of the 'political crap' forum.

Instead, I think we've colonised the General Chat. Huzzah!

[ImperatorMortis]

At least dolphins aren't sexist.

When it comes to lovin' dolphins don't discriminate.

Also how do you know they aren't sexist?



That dolphin could be yelling at the other dolphin to get back in the kitchen for all we know.

[vortexTechie]

Evil linked with intelligence? More like stupidity.

[CSJ]

That dolphin could be yelling at the other dolphin to get back in the kitchen for all we know.

Dolphins have kitchens?

[ImperatorMortis]

Dolphins have kitchens?

Coral reef then.

[MQuinny1234]

Dolphins rape each other.

[AProcrastinatingWriter]

Dolphins rape each other.

this is a totally new topic that heretofore we had not at all discussed in this topic

[ImperatorMortis]

Dolphins rape each other.

I know. I mentioned that in the OP.

[vortexTechie]

You should know that it's not how intelligent you are, it's how you put that intelligence to use.

Because, well..... I don't see Stephen Hawking mass-murdering people, don't you?

[ImperatorMortis]

You should know that it's not how intelligent you are, it's how you put that intelligence to use.

Because, well..... I don't see Stephen Hawking mass-murdering people, don't you?

Thats because he's paralyzed.

[vortexTechie]

Thats because he's paralyzed.

LOL. XD
+1 to you, good sir.

But still..... he could hide a couple of guns in that chair.........

[MQuinny1234]

Huh.

Kay, can you really be called evil if you're innocent, mentally I mean, as in you have no definition of right and wrong?

[_Quietus_]

Absolutely
If evil people had morals, most of them would not engage in evil activities.